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So, anyone watching this? It's not Bruce Timm, but the creators of Gargoyles has a good enough track record if pedigree is that important to you. It continues the tradition of DC being able to put out good animated series about their characters, despite the fact that I generally like Marvel characters more.

So Young Justice is about a group of teenage superheroes that end up acting as the Justice League's low profile arm. They're all connected to the big boys in one way or another. Despite the fact that the teen superhero thing usually doesn't work for me (Young Avengers was the only exception), DC's insistance on naming young heroes things no teenager would every pick for themselves (Superboy? Miss Martian? Kid Flash? Aqualad? What kind of teenager would pick those names? Does the Justice League inflict these names on their proteges as some kind of hazing thing?) the show works and works well.
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The Roster

Aqualad-group leader and all around awesome despite the name and the association with Aquaman

Dick Grayson Robin-tech guy and Batperson of the group.

Wally West Kid Flash-what it says on the tin

Miss Martian-telekinetic, telepath, and mild shapeshifting. Apparently the stuff that put the Martian Manhunter at Superman's level are advanced techniques. Yes she's been nerfed so she doesn't walk over most villains solo.

Conner Kent Superboy-strength, toughness, improved sight and hearing. Yes no flight, x-ray, or heat vision and his power levels are lowered. May develop more later, but again nerfed down so it doesn't become "the super aliens beat the shit out of everyone while the rest of the team claps" show.

Artemis-Green Arrow associated archer.

Red Arrow and a teenaged, pants wearing Zatanna aren't members, but show up in some episodes.

And the show itself? Well written and well acted. There's an over arching series plot involving a shadow group of supervillian heavy hitters and Young Justice gets involved in stopping some of their more overt plots as well as the characters dealing with personal problems, baggage, and dark secrets. The whole team is there for most episodes, but not all, allowing for episodes where Sportsmaster and Chesire can threaten half the team as they try to carry out an assassination without Superboy being there to beat them like red headed stepchildren.

Like superheroes? Then watch this.

I've been watching it since it came out last year (when it still played on Saturday Evenings on Cartoon Network).

They've recently (since it came back from it's mid-season break in December) swapped it to Saturday mornings to pair with the Green Lantern CGI Cartoon (which in and of itself ISN'T that bad....)


At first, there some confusion about who Robin was - it was never out and out stated that Robin was Dick Grayson until several episodes in, this Robin shared enough personality traits with both Jason Todd and Tim Drake that it could have been any of them....but the episode that introduced Amazo and Ivo pretty much solidified it to be the Grayson Robin.

The overall episodes are all pretty strong stand alone, and the overall story arc with the Light is quickly coming to a Head (especially with what we say in Ep 23). The fact we learn pretty much most of Superboy's Origins, and why he can't use the full Kryptonian Powers are filled in nicely in their own episode, as well as getting to explore some of Me'gaan's stuff in Episode...20 I think it is.

Also, the high point of the first season, for me, can be found in Episode 16 "Failsafe", and it's follow up, Episode 17 "Disordered". These two episodes really showcase Weisman's abilities to lead a show to be VERY good - though I won't spoil them for those who have yet to see it. We see the characters grow and change in these two episodes, with realizations which mark them as full characters instead of just cardboard cutouts.

Though it should be noted, that as of Episode 19, Zartanna becomes a full member of Young Justice (she seems to be shaping up to be a love interest for Dick) and as of Episode 23 Red Arrow joins the team as well.


While it is not the Timm-verse, Young Justice is a very worthy sucessor, set in one of the "Alternate Earth" universes - I thin Weisman and company has said it was set on Earth 16 since it was a Universe that had not been explored much in the other media.

But if you were a fan of the Timm-verse DCAU shows, and a fan of Gargoyles (I think nearly all of us here were fans of the first two seasons of Gargoyles) then Young Justice should be given a look at.

Actually I liked the ambiguity about Robin's identity (though I do seem to have read he was identified as Dick Grayson in the credits from the word go), especially as there was a lot of Jason Todd in his personality. Historically, it would have to be Dick with Wally still as Kid Flash, but the presence of Megan, Artemis, Calder, Conner and Zatanna already mean they're not the original team (in fact I don't think Zatanna was ever on any iteration of the team).
It may be no Timmverse but it's pretty damned close. I like the premise-a team of young superheroes in a world that does have the grownup ones (Teen Titans, while brilliant, was essentially about a world where the kid heroes were the only ones) that won't always do as they're told.
'The Light' so far proves to be an interesting and intriguingly mysterious villain. I liked the subtle hints dropped here and there about their possible connections without outright stating whom they were with, or they way they wove other, more prominent villains into this.
The voice acting (if not always the choice of voice actor though that comes down to personal taste a lot) is very good, and while this isn't Timmverse the producers of YJ, either on purpose or by accident, have managed to match a number of the more prominent Leaguers' speech pattern closely to they way they were there (ref me and JJ).
The only qualm I have with visuals, which are in my opinion very good to excellent, is the occasional costume choice. Arthur-give the guy either the original duds or let him keep the beard, this just looks silly. I pefer JJs original duds, but this works okay for me. While I can't put my finger on it, there's something wrong with the way Red Tornado looks.
Conversely, I love Wally's camo suit, and the outfits they gave the Hawks look awesome.
The team dynamics work pretty damned well-people have issues with themselves/one another, they have little quirks, like Richard never taking off his sunglasses, Megan's obsessive cliche 50 housewife behaviour (and boy didn't I see that explanation coming ), Wally constantly eating and hitting on pretty much anything with a second X chromosome, and Conner's consistent inability to come up with creative names. Also, many of them seem to have dirty secrets they'd rather keep to themselves.
So far, I like it a lot.
And no DS I still haven't watched ep24 yet.

On Episode 10. Is good so far. Although...

You have an alien girl with no real experience with normal terrans and a clone who wasn't alive 6 months ago...

You throw then straight into high school... Why? Education isn't the goal here, as the League could frankly do a better job then the public school system. Socialization, is important but this is likely to result in negative socialization, it's high school! Not a pleasant environment. Taking things in steps somehow would have been a better idea (maybe starting with Atlantians? They seem... calmer then us). I do agree that they need to have social exposure to normal mundane folks, this just seems a poorly thought out to do it.

I like Grayson so far, alot of shows turn him into a mini-batman with angst, angst, angst, which doesn't ring true. Dick Grayson enjoys what he does, he likes being a Superhero and has dealt with the death of his parents better then Bruce has (this is mostly because of Bruce ironically). A joking, snickering Robin is fairly close to Dick (I'm not seeing Todd honestly but I am seeing a fair amount of Tim, what with the computers, less then super social skills and all).

Aqualad is turning into one of my favorites. I like Miss Martian (when is she gonna admit to being a white martian? I learned that from a Teen Titan comic). Superboy is a bit different from the comics, granted I read more of his early stuff then the Teen Titan version who got mopey and dead. But in this version, his anger and confusion make sense. Big Blue needs to get on the ball though, while I get the uneasiness, Superman handled this better in the comics, becoming the kid's big brother. Maybe someone should introduce Conner to the Kents? I mean these are pretty much the Saints of Kansas here.

frigidmagi wrote: I like Grayson so far, alot of shows turn him into a mini-batman with angst, angst, angst, which doesn't ring true. Dick Grayson enjoys what he does, he likes being a Superhero and has dealt with the death of his parents better then Bruce has (this is mostly because of Bruce ironically). A joking, snickering Robin is fairly close to Dick (I'm not seeing Todd honestly but I am seeing a fair amount of Tim, what with the computers, less then super social skills and all).

They do some awesome work with the Batman and Robin relationship, particularly episode 17. There's also a devastating exchange between Batman and Wonderwoman regarding Robin in one of the episodes.

Aqualad is turning into one of my favorites.

He only gets more awesome.

I like Miss Martian.

Her obsessive need to conform and get approval? Probably stems from that spoilerly thing you mentioned. There is pay off.

I find it somewhat amusing that Batman is shown to be the best father in the Justice League. This is also somewhat true in the comics, Wonder Women and Superman simply haven't had the success he's had in raising superheroes.

To be fair, Detective, Dick doesn't remove his glasses for a simple reason - YOU told him he could not reveal his Civilian ID to the team.

So while he dresses in civvies when not on a mission and in the cave with the others of the Team - He keeps the glasses on to hide his eyes.

How is that supposed to keep his ID secret from a Telepath? Who knows.


The episode with the two unpowered members of the Team going against the Red's, was particularly fun - as it helped showcase Artemis a bit more than she had been up to that time.

I like how Cheshire flirts with Roy, it's a nice call back to the Teen Titans comics. I had to dig to find out Artemis story (they changed.... Well everything really), I think I like this one better. Having finished episode 24, I am duly impressed with how they work things. It's well done.

That said... This team? It's either made of glass or steel with no middle ground. There's a shit ton of secrets and when they come out? It's gonna be bad. Everything from Miss Martian's real "ethnicy" to Artemis' backstory, to Superboy's dealing with his... Genetic Donor (Not Big Blue, the other one). A real toxic brew is bubbling away here.

Honestly, with all the shit they've been through, I think the team is definitely made more of Steel than Glass, frigid.

They've been through thick and thin, life and death, and I honestly don't think ANY of them are a spy. I don't think Artemis turned when her Dad showed up in her bedroom and she has genuine feelings for Wally (and Wally for her, despite being to stupid to see/admit to it), Mee'gan just wants to fit in more than anything (though she will do what she can to safeguard Garth (Spoiler Alert: he's the future Beast Boy) from Queen Bee, and while Superboy may have some genetic tampering in his genes and brain - I think him becoming addicted to the Shields would cause him to betray more than anything else.

Well, that and the Boy Scout pretty much IGNORING Superboy at every turn and distancing himself when they do meet up. Which is a shame because I think Conner very much wants to get to know Clark and do good by him - be worthy of the S, as it were.

Episode was a good bit with Dick's background, and very telling he was willing to take the team undercover without even Batman's permission - while Caldur is a excellent team, they're all expecting Robin to step up eventually (but so is Caldur by his own admission).

It's to bad Dick doesn't want to become Batman. He already knows he wants out.

Episode 25 is today, guess we'll see what happens there.

Dark Silver wrote: To be fair, Detective, Dick doesn't remove his glasses for a simple reason - YOU told him he could not reveal his Civilian ID to the team.
So while he dresses in civvies when not on a mission and in the cave with the others of the Team - He keeps the glasses on to hide his eyes.
How is that supposed to keep his ID secret from a Telepath? Who knows.

The glasses work as a visual visual disguise about as well as the mask that goes with the Robin suit (i.e. not at all). I know why he's doing it, I just like the consistency of it (remember, this series is in no small part about those people deciding to not do as they're told, at at least one team member knows Dick's secret identity anyway).

as for the glass vs steel thing, I think the secret with the most repercussions when it finally comes out is Artemis (and am I missing something or is that her real and her code name?) lying about her heritage.
The issue with Conner frigid is probably referring to isn't so much his half-Luthorian genetic heritage (which is hardly his fault) but the fact that he didn't tell the team about his dealings with Luthor, which he might yet do, that was what, 3 episodes ago? If anything, as you say, shield addiction is far more probable to become an issue.
The Megan reveal I predict to be a big 'Um-so what?' for everybody but her. They know she's a Martian, they know she's a shapeshifter, I wouldn't be surprised if upon finding out her true looks the team essentially goes 'Um-that's what J'Onn looks like only he's green so we kinda figured' and only went along with her antics in 'Image' because it apparently was important to her.

Well, that and the Boy Scout pretty much IGNORING Superboy at every turn and distancing himself when they do meet up. Which is a shame because I think Conner very much wants to get to know Clark and do good by him - be worthy of the S, as it were.

I actually like that part. It sucks from Conner's perspective to be true but as storytelling goes, it's a nice departure from the usual 'Superman is nice to everybody' angle usually taken by DC. Conner being a clone of him clearly makes Clark uncomfortable enough that instead of dealing with the fact, he just avoids interacting with Conner as much as he can, which I find to be a perfectly human (not reasonable, human) reaction. Besides, how often do you get me having to tell Clark to be more sociable?

It's to bad Dick doesn't want to become Batman. He already knows he wants out.

Wait what since when does Dick want out? In the very same 'Talk to Dr Canary' scene in 'Disordered' where he admits he no longer wants to be Batman he also states 'And the hero bit? I'm still all in.' He just no longer wants to become my succesor as Batman, and nobody sane wants to be Batman.

Hell Batman doesn't want Dick to be Batman. Fuck, Batman doesn't want anyone to be like him, that is the whole point of Batman.

Having seen episode 25. This team is steel. Which is good, they're gonna need it. Fuck Vandal Savage anyways. Asshole.

frigidmagi wrote: Fuck Vandal Savage anyways. Asshole.

His whole bag is "immortal asshole." I mean really this is a guy who falls in love with the woman who he enslaves and repeatedly rapes because he admires her spirit in defying him. He's been a practicing dickbag for 50,000 years and is naturally talented at it.

Yeah, the team really is made out of steel, I was amused that Superboy already knew Meg'ans real form and her fears were entirely unfounded - and I loved the plan to get everything backfired on The Light.

So the entire time, Red Arrow was the mole, and he never knew it, a sleeper agent of the Light. I wonder when it was they got him.....and I always wondered what the Teched Starro tentacle would be used for.

Right now, the Light is moving into it's end game, and I feel sorry for the Team.

Certainly didn't see Red Arrow as the mole coming. Very nice episode. So all the secrets are out in the open (and as usual, Robin already knew-attaboy ) and I wasn't too far off on the team's reaction to Megan's real form. (I'm a detective, not a soothsayer).
And if the way the team turned the tables on Luthor & co is any indication of things to come I'm almost feeling sorry for The Light.
Should I know who this Icon fellow and his sidekick are?

And yes, definitely steel.

Well, that was a interesting episode.

All said and done, the Justice League was under Savage and Clarion's control for about 24 hours....

The Light is not beaten, they've managed to still get to the next phase of their Overall Plan, and it looks like the Justice League has a part to play in it....



Nice to see the pairings that came out at the end for the "New Years" kiss.
Also, Wally? About fucking time.

He may be the fastest teenager alive, but to quote something Conner once said to Bart, 'Although you're very fast, you're not too...swift.'
Not ending on a cliffhanger and the series continues without a break? Awesome.
The almost had me with my 'Ha-ha, we solved all the problems from last episode while you weren't looking' speech at the beginning.
Roy turning hero again after his program was complete was nice storytelling, but pretty sloppy programming on the part of The Light (assuming he is a free agent now. I know it's a superhero pastiche, but Roy getting away while Savage gloated was a little too convenient for my tastes).
The new year's kiss pairings were pretty much preprogrammed I think-Conner and Megan were already a couple anyway, we were all but hit over the head with the Artemis/Wally thing, and they weren't all that subtle about the budding Dick/Zatanna relationship or Rocket having a thing for Calder either. Is she actually from the comics, by the way? Because her powers and appearance look a lot like Argent.

Yeah, Rocket and Icon are both from the comics, her powers come from some alien tech she wears, a Inertia Belt.

I was just curious because I never heard of either of them before.

They're from another comic book company that was picked up by DC recently and retconnd in. Mile High Comics or something like that.

So, with Episode 26, we now know most of the Light's plans - as expoused by Vandal Savage.

Namely to force the human race into a period of chaos to somehow speed up the evolutionary process - on a step to turning the Earth into the center of some Interstellar Empire.

One would think that with beings like the Green Lanterns on Earth, the Light would realieze that organizations like the GLC wouldn't let that happen - DCAU Earth may be more advanced and cutting edge than "our" Earth, Earth Tech would still be behind civilizations who have been space faring for centuries or eons. Hell, unless they make mass use of STARRO Tech....how could they defeat the GLC is the Guardians decide to step up and in?

But then again, I may have just given the answer - Starro Tech. It works on damn near everyone simply because it incorporates the Starro Alien into it's base. That and it looks like their getting help from Apocalypse in the form of Boom Tubes and weaponry.

I wonder what the Light will do with the original Roy while he's on ice now.....and they have Match (I'm calling it now, he's going to become Bizarro Superman once he's programmed some more). Also calling the fact that Guardian will be a older Roy clone, not Roy's "uncle" as he explained to Superboy - he was standing by while Ra's and Luther were looting the cold storage vault because of a code word programmed into him. Either that....or he's infected with Starro Tech.

Season Two is suppossed to be starting this weekend - if not within the next month, and the Team is going to be getting a expanded roster - it looks like Wonder Girl will be making her appearence.

So-who's the fourth flavour of alien? There's Clark, JJ and the Hawks of course but with the possible exception of Icon everybody else on the League is from Earth (if not necessarily human) unless I missed somebody.

Icon is an alien.

Would have been nice if they actually told us that. Far as I recall all we're ever told about the guy is that he isn't kryptonian.

You aren't told much about the other legionaries either.

Most if not all of the others are long established DCU characters (hence me being able to immediately identify Clark, the Hawks and JJ as three of the alien 'flavours'). Icon is not.
I'm not saying it has any impact on the narrative or anything, it just annoys me. I consider myself moderately well informed about the DC Universe, and when my own Valendamned sidekick says there's four different kinds of aliens in the Justice League, I expect to know who and what they are.
You're just grumpy that Master Richard knew more than you do in this instance.
Well and that.